In this episode of the Fourth Option podcast, author Jack Carr interviewed former Navy SEAL K9 handler John Devine about the SEAL dog program and Devine's contributions to Carr's latest novel featuring a Belgian Malinois named Paladin. Devine, who now runs Divine Canines and the Rescue 22 Foundation providing service dogs to veterans, detailed the highly selective nature of the SEAL K9 pipeline, revealing that only 30% of imported dogs successfully complete training—a failure rate comparable to BUD/S. The conversation covered the program's origins in the early 2000s when Special Operations were unprepared for the IED threat and contracted Israeli trainers, including Mike Hirschstick, who had built Israel's bomb dog program during the late 1990s suicide bombing wave. Devine explained that experienced handlers develop the ability to distinguish between human and explosive threats purely by reading their dog's body language at entry points, an intelligence capability that surpasses even thermal imaging. He described how SEAL teams specifically select larger, harder Belgian Malinois weighing up to 95 pounds whose bite force can audibly break bones, as they need dogs capable of extracting combatants actively fighting versus merely fleeing. The discussion also covered training progressions from basic obedience through advanced scenarios involving helicopters, breaching charges, and how dogs learn to ignore flashbangs that resemble toys. Devine warned that Hollywood portrayals have created unrealistic expectations, with many civilians unprepared for the high-drive nature of Belgian Malinois. The episode concluded with details about how retired SEAL dogs are rehomed with handlers or placed at the Warrior Dog Foundation when handlers remain on active duty or the dogs aren't suitable for family environments.
John Devine, former SEAL K9 handler, revealed on Jack Carr's podcast that experienced handlers can distinguish between human threats and explosive devices solely by reading their dog's body language at entry points. This capability, developed through months of observation during operational deployments, provided intelligence that even thermal imaging couldn't match.
Read this moment →The SEAL K9 program was established in the early 2000s by contracting the same trainers, including Mike Hirschstick, who had built Israel's explosive detection dog program in the late 1990s in response to frequent suicide bombings. This direct operational knowledge transfer brought proven counter-IED tactics from the Israeli experience directly into U.S. Special Operations.
Read this moment →Devine revealed that Special Operations forces had no established K9 program to counter the IED threat when operations began in Iraq and Afghanistan. Initially, SEAL teams had to borrow military police dogs and handlers from gate guard duty, telling them to follow operators who would keep them safe while utilizing the dog's explosive detection capability.
Read this moment →Devine disclosed that the SEAL K9 program maintains a roughly 70% attrition rate for dogs, comparable to the human BUD/S pipeline. The program imported dogs from Netherlands vendors with agreements allowing failed candidates to be redistributed to sheriff's departments and agencies like the FBI rather than being euthanized.
Read this moment →Devine described the extreme capabilities of the larger Belgian Malinois used by SEAL teams, noting that dogs weighing up to 95 pounds possess bite force powerful enough to audibly break human bones. He explained SEAL teams specifically select larger, harder dogs than typical law enforcement because they need animals capable of extracting combatants who are actively trying to kill versus simply escape.
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